Conflicting statements by No campaigners about Indigenous treaties and changing the date of Australia Day have sparked bizarre scenes.
Conflicting statements by leading No campaigners about Indigenous treaties and changing the date of Australia Day have sparked bizarre scenes, with Barnaby Joyce repeatedly refusing to say whether he supported Warren Mundine’s comments.
Mr Mundine appeared on ABC’s Insiders on Sunday morning where he reiterated his calls for Aboriginal land rights and changing Australia Day from January 26, while arguing both outcomes would be more realistic if the No vote wins.
On Seven’s Sunrise on Monday, Nationals MP Barnaby Joyce was asked whether No side supported Mr Mundine’s position that if the referendum fails, it was more likely there would be treaties with Indigenous Australians.
The former Deputy Prime Minister would not answer, saying instead that “right now we are focused on the referendum”.
“There’s no doubt that the Yes side has big business, unions and a big pile of money and we don’t take this referendum as a joke,” he said. “We think it’s incredibly important that people understand you’ve got a big change to your constitution, the biggest change in the history of Australia.”
Host Nat Barr pressed, “The question was about a prominent No campaigner yesterday going on national television and saying if the No camp wins there will be more chance that there will be treaties with Indigenous Australians and that the Australia Day date will change. Is that what your side believes?”
Mr Joyce replied that Australia was a “peaceful nation that has never had major internal conflict” that “lives with the No case as the status quo”.
“I can’t see why that will substantially change in regards to treaty but I can tell you that delivering on the Uluru Statement in full is yes to the referendum, yes to treaty,” he said.
Barr asked three more times whether Mr Joyce supported Mr Mundine’s comments, getting a similar response each time.
“I state the obvious of where we are now — we live in the status quo and that has been incredibly good to Australia,” Mr Joyce said.
Labor MP Tanya Plibersek interjected, “Why won’t Barnaby answer the question?”
Speaking to Insiders, Mr Mundine said, “I’ve always been honest, even though I know people on my side don’t agree with me on these two issues.”
On changing the date, he said January 26 “will always be an important day because of the fact that European countries came to Australia and set up the colonies here”.
“We can’t get away from that, but we can’t become captive of it,” he said.
“We have to face the facts and move on. Yes, recognise history. Yes, recognise the invasion. Recognise the good and bad that is in our history, but we still have to move on. We are going through this perennial argument which is not helping us. We are just arguing and arguing and arguing about this … we need to confront it and talk about it. We need to have a mature debate.”
Mr Mundine said he also supported “treaties in the plural sense because we have to recognise Aboriginal culture” and that treaties “solve issues of sovereignty”.
“We need to give protection to Aboriginal culture and Aboriginal heritage on these lands and we are moving very strongly in that position with the Land Rights Act and Native Title Act where Aboriginal people have a major say on what happens on their land,” he said.
“We need to resolve the issues and stop the fights.”
Mr Mundine said he opposed the Indigenous Voice to Parliament because it would simply put “another body of bureaucracy” on top of these existing systems.
He said a treaty would be more likely if Australians vote No.
“Because on October 15, if it is a No vote, that’s when the real work starts,” he said.
“We have to have accountability. We are spending billions of dollars every year and according to Closing the Gap we are still not going places. We have to deal with that. And also the real things about accountability, in education, in jobs and that needs to be done. Now, if we can do just three things — accountability, jobs and education — then we will resolve most of the problems we’ve got.”
Treaty is one of the three elements of the 2017 Uluru Statement from the Heart — “Voice, Treaty and Truth”.
Victoria and Queensland have begun formal treaty processes, while others have agreed to large treaty-style native title settlements such as the Noongar agreement covering 320,000 hectares in Western Australia.
Prime Minister Anthony Albanese had previously attempted to distance the Voice referendum from the question by pointing out those processes were already in motion at a state level.
“That’s [already] occurring,” he told ABC Radio last month. “That’s like saying, do you support the sun coming up?”
Appearing on Sky News later on Sunday, Mr Mundine took aim at Indigenous activists pushing for a treaty such as Lidia Thorpe and Thomas Mayo, saying they were “out to destroy Australia”.
“When they talk about treaty, what they are talking about is actually overriding the traditional owners of this country,” he said.
“The traditional owners, since 1993 when the Native Title Act came in, plus going back to 1976 when the Land Rights Act came in, have had the power to negotiate, consult and come to agreements on what happens on their land. And that to me is what it’s all about, it’s about having Indigenous Australians who are able to protect their cultural heritage, able to protect their country, and able to get economic development and jobs and kids to school through that process.”
Mr Mundine said the Yes campaign was “built on a lie that Aboriginal people do not have voices”. “Every corporation in Australia, every sporting body, every church … they all have Indigenous advisory committees or advisers,” he said.
“This whole thing is just a fraud which has been pushed by these people.”
Mr Mundine’s position is at odds with fellow No campaign leader Senator Jacinta Nampijinpa Price, the Opposition’s Indigenous Australians spokeswoman, who said last week she rejected the concept of a treaty with First Nations people because they were never at war with British colonists.
Ms Price told The Great Voice Debate in Canberra, hosted by The Australian, that she feared the first priority for the Voice to Parliament would be treaty and reparations.
“There’s no shying away from it,” she said.
“If proponents want to suggest otherwise then that is just the exercise … of gaslighting Australians. We need honesty in this debate. We know that that is the agenda of many who support the voice and we’re not going to take any other suggestion otherwise. There are treaties in negotiation around the country right now.”
She added, “It’s one law for all as far as I’m concerned. And this is the problem that treaty poses for the Australian people. And again, you can’t have treaty with your own citizens. There was, as far as I know not a declaration of war for there to be a treaty.”
The Northern Territory Senator had earlier sparked controversy after telling the National Press Club that colonisation had “no ongoing negative impacts” on Indigenous Australians.
“A positive impact? Absolutely,” she said.
“I mean, now we’ve got running water, we’ve got readily available food. I mean everything my grandfather had when he was growing up, because he first saw whitefellas in his early adolescence, we now have. Many of us have the same opportunities as all other Australians in this country.”
On Sunday, thousands of Yes supporters marched in cities across Australia, attempting to turn around flagging public support for the referendum which opinion polls suggest is on track for defeat.
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